The Patterson-Ferrell Connection: Part 1 | Part 2 | Part 3 | Part 4 | Part 5
How Robert and Elizabeth Patterson of 1810 Buncombe Co., NC are Related to Thomas Patterson of 1800 Buncombe
Last Revised: 28 January 2019In Part 3 I covered several aspects of Robert Patterson in Buncombe Co., NC between 1800 and 1810. In those records one can see several Pattersons and the related families and neighbors around them. But there were several Pattersons on the West side of the French Broad River, but not all were sons of Thomas Patterson, apparently. In this post I hope to show more evidence that ties Robert Patterson of Turkey Creek (Buncombe) to John Patterson of Jenkins Branch, and therefore to Thomas Patterson of Jenkins Branch.
Various Patterson males are identified in various records in Buncombe from 1800 to 1820, in the Jenkins Branch/Sandy Mush/Newfound/Turkey Creek section near Alexander, NC. This is about 8 or 10 miles NW of Asheville, and on the west side of the river. These records include census, deed, and church records for the most part. Names seen include Thomas, John, John Sr, John Jr, Robert, Alexander, Andrew, James, and Joseph. Again, I am only focusing on the part of Buncombe in the region previously described.
So who were all of these Pattersons?
Some are yet to be identified. However, given the fact that these men were loosely connected as witnesses to deeds, there seems to be some relation among them all. The least evidence would be regarding Alexander. But Andrew appeared as a witness on the 1802 deed where Richard Morrow sold land to John Patterson. This John had to be the John that was born in ca. 1765, the son of Thomas. There was another John, known as John Marion Patterson, who was born ca. 1785-90, but he would not have been old enough in 1802 to be the grantee. In a later deed, there is reference to John Sr and John Jr. The Sr is the John born 1765, and the Jr is the one born 1785/90.
But Jr was not the son of Sr. John Patterson, born 1798, was the son of John Patterson "Sr". So who was "Jr"? I believe he was the son of Peter Patterson of York Co., SC, brother of Thomas. So that would make Jr the nephew of Sr.
I also believe that Andrew and James (b. 1784) were sons of Peter. I don't wish to write a thesis on why at this time. I simply want to loosely identify who the Pattersons were in this part of Buncombe between 1800/20, and draw conclusions from that.
James Patterson, born 1784, married in 1810 to Sarah Morrow (aka Marr). There was a James Morrow who also was a witness to the 1802 John Patterson deed along with Andrew Patterson. James Morrow married an Elizabeth, and they had a son named Peter Patterson Morrow. I suspect, but cannot prove, that James and Sarah Morrow were siblings, and they married siblings, Elizabeth and James Patterson, children of Peter Patterson.
By the time these younger Pattersons (Andrew, James, John "Jr", Elizabeth P. Morrow, etc) came into Buncombe (between 1800 and 1810), Peter Patterson had recently died in York Co., SC. The Thomas Patterson clan had been in Buncombe since the mid to late 1790's.
Another key sibling to Thomas and Peter Patterson was Elizabeth, their sister. She married Daniel Ponder, Jr. in York Co., SC, and they and their sons were very instrumental in the land deeds with these Pattersons in Buncombe, as well as at Newfound Baptist Church. More on the church minutes in a minute.
Regarding the Pattersons of this community and time period, that leaves Robert and Joseph. I've already stated I believe that Robert (born 1766/8) was a brother to John (born 1762/5). As for Joseph, he was Joseph B. Patterson, son of John - and his wife, Margaret "Peggy" Black. I believe, but cannot prove, that Peggy was the daughter of Joseph Black of York Co., SC, and his wife Sarah Patterson. Yes, another key sibling to Thomas and Peter Patterson, and Elizabeth P. Ponder. If this was the case, then John and Peggy were first cousins.
Newfound Baptist Church
But none of the Morrows are named, nor are the Pattersons whom I believe to be Peter's sons (James, John Marion, Andrew). For that matter, Thomas isn't mentioned either, but given the fact that his land was sold by the sheriff of Buncombe in 1804, and the church minutes begin in 1803, I presume that Thomas had either died already, or had moved out of the area.
John and Robert Patterson are named numerous times in the church minutes. This is the only way we even know the name of Robert's wife, Elizabeth. And as for John's wife, Margaret Black is all I have ever seen... until I saw in these minutes one of the records refer to her by her nickname, Peggy. These two guys were close. And, as the minutes of the church reveal, they were almost as close to the Flemings (Plemmons) as they were each other. That begs the question, was Robert's wife Elizabeth a Fleming/Pleming/Plemmons by birth? I know they were next door neighbors on Turkey Creek to Clem Davis. His wife was a Plemmons, for certain.
The following records are excerpts from the Newfound Baptist Church minutes, involving Robert Patterson. In many of the references for Robert, you'll also see references to John Patterson, as well as Daniel Ponder, or just Ponder. Remember, Daniel Ponder was the uncle of Robert and John Patterson. Some of this is hard to read, but you can make out the general context. The clerk rarely used punctuation, so names run together, and many times he'll use both names for one person, followed by a last name only for the next person. Anywhere you see [brackets], that is my notation.
July the 20th D 1805 the church of christ at newfound acording to apoinmtnet and efter worship preceded to the Bisnes of the day … 2nd chose five members to set in a church way on homnuny the July meting 1805 to wit John lonmyer [John Longmire] daron frelmon [Aaron Freeman] henry woods & thomas worth Robt Patterson …
January the
18th 1806 the church met acording to apointment & eter worship
proceded to the Bisness of the day … 4th appointed daniel ponder
richerd kwel [Richard Keel] john Patterson John
grantham John longmire to settle any mater of dealings Betwen any of the
members of this church in any trading without going to law until tha have gadge
the matter and to contine for one year uon good Behaveyour 5th
apointe Bro. John Patterson & Bro. robert Patterson to sight Bro Joseph Blache [Joseph Black] richerd kwel & [Richard Keel] thomas worth to sight John rwede [John Reed] to our next church mating a Journd.
March 14th
Day. 1807 . . the church according to apointment & after worship proceded
to the Buisness of the Day … 3rd sister Rachel plemmons aplied &
obtained A letter of dimission & Bro.
John Patterson to right said Letter 4th Agrease that we send A letter
& 7 Deligates to the Baptist Conferance the 4th Saturday in
aprile at cain creeke meating House 5th appointed Brother thomas
Worth ponder [Daniel Ponder] John Patterson Longmire & John grantham Be appointed as
formeley to try any Matter of Dealing Between eny members of this church before
going to Law & this church deligats church to inquire into thear ability to
wit thomas Snelson Jehu Wever Ponder
Woods Smith John and robert Patterson Black
& Freeman John Pleman ingrn John grantham J Longmire appointment of members
to the confernce is as follows thomas snelson Ponder weever Smith wells longmire Freemon A D
September
the 19th day 1807 the churh met acording to appointment and after
divine worship proceded to the business of the day … 2nd and
appoointed Bro robert Patterson deacon
in this church adJourd
July the 16th
day 1808 the church of christ at newfound met acording to appoionment and after
worship broceeded to the busness of the day 1th the matter of Bro black laid of over tell next
meeting in course and John Patterson
is to site him to meeting 2d sister Stansels Matter laid over tell meeting in
course Bro caler and Bro webb to site her to next meeting in course 3d a reqert
from french broad church for helps to attend in august on the account of A
destress in that church was answerd and they following Breth were acoreding
appointed viz Snelson ponder John Patterson
4th Brethren were apponted to attend the Association viz Snelson ponder John Patterson and Robert Patterson AdJournd - - -
Satraday Janury 14 1809 the church met Acording to
apointment and after divne warship Proseded to tak up the mater by the brethren
of the brethren wards laid under senture or the church after long labeurs wee
Find them ripe for excomuniction and Proseeded to exclek them the Naes to wit 1
John dunken robert Patterson and
wife 3 elizebeth 4 John Patterson and his wife margret 5 thomas Plemons and his wife
elizebeth 7 John Plemons Chel Plemons the charge that wee the church has
against them are these 1 standing vindeate anofwax take woman Poly Plemans
formeley for maring hoten with in eight day after shee first seed Him contrary
to the advice of hur Parenc and friends the beeing susspeians of his beeing
marid man 2 far not leeving him sed acten she heard that hee had another wife 3
far not greeing with the church in retracting apon the act of the recaption of
the woman 4 far thley far taken appon them selvs to work as a church with out
eny legal athority Nancy brooks lise under the sensure of the church till the
next Meeting in corse and alsow all the rest of the members that stood in bee
half of the woman tant wards not present to day - - - A D
The Patterson, Plemons, and John Duncan were all later reinstated in the church fellowship once the matter of Polly Plemons' married to was considered adultery or not. There was a question about whether her new husband had another wife elsewhere at the time. As you can see, however, the Pattersons put everything on the line along with the Plemons family in defense of Polly. Also, John Duncan did too. His daughter, Polly Duncan, became the daughter-in-law of John Patterson a short while later, when she married Joseph Patterson.
Although the persons who were excommunicated from the church in January 1809 were reinstated, not all returned. Robert and Elizabeth Patterson left the area in 1810, as we have already established. John and Peggy Patterson returned to the church, however, and were active until 1815. John Patterson was noted on multiple occasions as being selected to keep a small book and keep the notes. Other times he was cited to write a letter to send to someone. So John Patterson was clearly an educated man, at least educated enough to read and write. That said, the "original" church minutes that are microfilmed and still view-able today, are not exactly the originals that John Patterson would have written. In 1853, the condition of the minutes going back to the church's beginnings in 1803, were in such shape that church members then (in 1853) re-transcribed all of the minutes. So the old microfilmed records that we can see today, are all from 1853 forward, but at least it covers the records back to 1803.
The Link Back to York Co., SC
B-277. 20 March 1786
Thomas Patterson of York County, to Robert Patterson of same for 35 pounds, 60 acres in York County on both sides of Clarks fork of Bullocks Creek, a survey of land granted to Thomas by patent dated 22 April 1767, adjoining Harrisons old line, Blacks old line. Signed Thomas Patterson.
Witnesses: Peter Patterson, Benjamin White, Daniel Ponder. Proved: 20 --- 1790 by Peter Patterson. [WP: This Thomas was the father of John Patterson of Buncombe in 1810, and Peter and Robert Patterson and Daniel Ponder were all uncles of John Patterson. I'm not yet sure who the Benjamin White was.]
Another deed that ties Daniel Ponder to the John and Margaret Black Patterson family is one from York Co SC in 1787 involving a John Swann deed where James Kincaid and Daniel Ponder were the witnesses. James Kincaid was a brother-in-law of John and Margaret Black Patterson. Margaret's sister, Susannah Black, married James Kincaid in York Co., SC. Here is that deed:
D-454 30 August 1787
John Swann, son and heir to Robert Swann, deceased of Camden District to Wilkinson Turner, 200 acres on both sides of Bell's branch of King's Creek being a tract of land granted to Robert Swann, deceased.
The following York Co SC deed regarding Daniel Ponder shows him associated with his brother-in-law Peter Patterson (brother of Thomas) and also with Buncombe Co NC.
G-527 22 January 1798
William and Robert Love of York County to Peter Patterson, Sr. of York County, 212 acres, which is on both sides of ----------- branch of Clarks fork of Bullock Creek. The land was granted to Robert Love, deceased, on the 18 October 1792.
There are many more deeds involving Daniel Ponder and at least three of his sons, but these that I've listed are the main ones that show the proof of his ties to the John Patterson family, but even more so shows the ties between John Patterson of Buncombe and the Pattersons and Blacks of York Co SC (sometimes documented as Mecklenberg Co NC or Tryon Co NC or Craven Co SC or Camden District SC or York Co SC; in each case though, the key is that the land described on the deeds has something to do with "Clark's Fork of Bullocks Creek" and that is in modern day York Co SC).
Census records are the best we have for deriving 1762/5 as the birth year for John Patterson. The census records of 1800 and 1810 Buncombe (NC), 1820 Haywood (NC), and 1840 Union (GA) give us this date range. As for his wife, Peggy, ca. 1767 seems to fit best for her, using the same census records, plus the 1850 Union (GA) which listed her (twice) as 83, and born in SC. Here is the breakdown of John's age by census year:
So, if 1762/65 is the time frame, then who among the sons of Robert and Sarah Patterson could have been the father of John? The sons of Robert and Sarah whom we've identified are Thomas, James, Robert II (m. Mabel), Peter, and William.
William was still a minor in 1775 when Robert wrote his last will and testament. The impetus for updating his will that year appears to have been due to the death of his son James (1774/75). James had witnessed (chain carrier) the purchase of land in York Co., SC in 1767 by Robert Cravens, Jr. Seven years later, in 1774, James bought that same tract of land from Robert and Esther Harrison Cravens. Esther Harrison Cravens happened to have been a niece of old Robert Patterson, therefore a first cousin to this James Patterson. James was not mentioned in his father's 1775 will, and the land that he bought from the Cravens later ended up in the possession of Robert Sr, which indicates that James had died without heir. It is possible that James actually was alive until 1780 or so, but either way, he died without heir, and his land later ended up on the possession of John, son of Thomas, after 1790.
Peter Patterson, according to the 1790 York Co., SC census, has two sons who appear to be under the age of 16, therefore born after 1774. They would have been James b. 1784 and possibly John Marion born 1785/90. He also had an older son, born presumably between 1770/74. This may have been the Andrew that shows up later in Buncombe in 1802. Or, it may have been Alexander as the older son, and then Andrew and James as the younger ones, with John M. not yet born. At any rate, the ages don't necessarily seem to fit for John (b. 1762/5) to be his son. Especially with another son named John Marion Patterson born 1785/90.
That leaves Robert Patterson II who married Mabel Ponder, and then oldest son Thomas. Robert and Mabel's oldest child, a daughter, appears to have been born in September 1780. They clearly were married much too late to have been the parents of John of 1762/5. So that leaves Thomas. But not much is known about Thomas. Did he even have a son named John?
Thankfully, we do still have the afore-mentioned will of Robert Patterson from 1775. In that will he identifies his sons Thomas, Robert, Peter, and William, among others such as his wife and daughters. However, he only mentions one grandchild. And that happens to have been John Patterson, son of Thomas.
"Item I give and bequeath unto my son Thomas fifty pounds lawfull mony of South Carolina to be leveed out of my estate and all my cloathes except my fir hat and one gray three year old mare and colt to his son John."
Thus, we DO know that Thomas had a son named John. And, we do know that John and Thomas Patterson both lived in Buncombe Co., NC in 1800 and were enumerated "next to each other" in the semi-alphabetical list.
Let me explain. The census taker did not alphabetize his list. However, he did have a section of each letter of the alphabet. So one cannot tell if John Patterson lived next to George Black, based on the census. However, within the "P" section, it was not alphabetized, so one has to assume that two names next to each other, were either living next to each other, or were fairly close since no other "P" starting name was listed between them. In this case, Thomas Patterson and John Patterson were next to each other in Buncombe in 1800. Subsequent mapping of the deeds do show that the land John bought in 1805 was bordering the land that the sheriff sold in 1804 that had belonged to Thomas. Draw whatever conclusions you wish, but that's enough for me. John was most likely living on the same land that Thomas had, or was renting land next to him, which had previously been owned by their Black cousins and/or brother-in-law (George Black, and later Reuben Black).
1. Given the trail of evidence in deeds, wills, and church records between York Co., SC and Buncombe Co., NC, there is no question in my mind that John Patterson (b. 1762/5) was the son of Thomas, and that Thomas was the son of Robert and Sarah Patterson, who died in York Co., SC in 1775 and 1790, respectively.
2. Furthermore, there is no doubt in my mind that Robert Patterson of Buncombe was a brother of said John Patterson, and therefore another son of Thomas.
Wes Patterson
?-??? 29 September 1813
Daniel Ponder of Buncombe County, North Carolina to Peter Galloway of York County, South Carolina for $1000.00, two different surveys both sides of Clark's Fork of Bullock's Creek, 100 acres granted to Edward Moorhead and conveyed from him to Ponder & part of a survey granted to Robert Patterson and conveyed from him to Thomas Patterson and from him to Daniel Ponder; 70 acres beginning at Peter Patterson's station on the cross paths running thence n 23 back to the old line halfway to the corner thence straight across the paid land into the middle of the line between Peter Pattersons's corner and the upper corner of the said land thence down the said land to Peter Pattersons's corner thence along said Patterson's line to beginning. Signed: Elizabeth Ponder (X) & Daniel Ponder. [WP: This was Elizabeth Patterson Ponder, sister of Thomas Patterson[ Witnesses: John Wallace, Samuel Galloway & John Patterson. Elizabeth Ponder, wife of said Daniel Ponder relinquishes dower.
Another deed that ties Daniel Ponder to the John and Margaret Black Patterson family is one from York Co SC in 1787 involving a John Swann deed where James Kincaid and Daniel Ponder were the witnesses. James Kincaid was a brother-in-law of John and Margaret Black Patterson. Margaret's sister, Susannah Black, married James Kincaid in York Co., SC. Here is that deed:
D-454 30 August 1787
John Swann, son and heir to Robert Swann, deceased of Camden District to Wilkinson Turner, 200 acres on both sides of Bell's branch of King's Creek being a tract of land granted to Robert Swann, deceased.
Witnesses: James Donnelly, James Kinkead & Daniel Ponder. Proved by James Donnelly 1 March 1789. [Note by Patricia Saupe: Daniel Ponder's sister, Mary Polly Ponder married Nicholas Seahorn/Seehorn and their daughter Catherine b. 30 November 1770, married Samuel Swann 1790 York County, South Carolina. Further note by Deanna Ames: the Samuel Swann who married Catherine Seahorn was the brother of the above mentioned John Swann].
The following York Co SC deed regarding Daniel Ponder shows him associated with his brother-in-law Peter Patterson (brother of Thomas) and also with Buncombe Co NC.
G-527 22 January 1798
William and Robert Love of York County to Peter Patterson, Sr. of York County, 212 acres, which is on both sides of ----------- branch of Clarks fork of Bullock Creek. The land was granted to Robert Love, deceased, on the 18 October 1792.
Witnesses: Daniel Ponder, Elenor (x) Henry. Proved 10 October 1815. Malcolm Holcomb J.P. of Buncombe County, North Carolina.
There are many more deeds involving Daniel Ponder and at least three of his sons, but these that I've listed are the main ones that show the proof of his ties to the John Patterson family, but even more so shows the ties between John Patterson of Buncombe and the Pattersons and Blacks of York Co SC (sometimes documented as Mecklenberg Co NC or Tryon Co NC or Craven Co SC or Camden District SC or York Co SC; in each case though, the key is that the land described on the deeds has something to do with "Clark's Fork of Bullocks Creek" and that is in modern day York Co SC).
How do we know for sure that John Patterson was a son of Thomas?
- 1800 Buncombe NC: 26-44 (1756-1774)
- 1810 Buncombe NC: 45+ (1765 or earlier)
- 1820 Haywood NC: 45+ (1765 or earlier)
- 1840 Union GA: 70-79 (1761-1770)
The composite of these would put him at 1761-1765. Knowing that his parents were married on Dec. 24, 1761, it would be safe to assume that John was born between 1762 and 1765.
So, if 1762/65 is the time frame, then who among the sons of Robert and Sarah Patterson could have been the father of John? The sons of Robert and Sarah whom we've identified are Thomas, James, Robert II (m. Mabel), Peter, and William.
William was still a minor in 1775 when Robert wrote his last will and testament. The impetus for updating his will that year appears to have been due to the death of his son James (1774/75). James had witnessed (chain carrier) the purchase of land in York Co., SC in 1767 by Robert Cravens, Jr. Seven years later, in 1774, James bought that same tract of land from Robert and Esther Harrison Cravens. Esther Harrison Cravens happened to have been a niece of old Robert Patterson, therefore a first cousin to this James Patterson. James was not mentioned in his father's 1775 will, and the land that he bought from the Cravens later ended up in the possession of Robert Sr, which indicates that James had died without heir. It is possible that James actually was alive until 1780 or so, but either way, he died without heir, and his land later ended up on the possession of John, son of Thomas, after 1790.
Peter Patterson, according to the 1790 York Co., SC census, has two sons who appear to be under the age of 16, therefore born after 1774. They would have been James b. 1784 and possibly John Marion born 1785/90. He also had an older son, born presumably between 1770/74. This may have been the Andrew that shows up later in Buncombe in 1802. Or, it may have been Alexander as the older son, and then Andrew and James as the younger ones, with John M. not yet born. At any rate, the ages don't necessarily seem to fit for John (b. 1762/5) to be his son. Especially with another son named John Marion Patterson born 1785/90.
That leaves Robert Patterson II who married Mabel Ponder, and then oldest son Thomas. Robert and Mabel's oldest child, a daughter, appears to have been born in September 1780. They clearly were married much too late to have been the parents of John of 1762/5. So that leaves Thomas. But not much is known about Thomas. Did he even have a son named John?
Thankfully, we do still have the afore-mentioned will of Robert Patterson from 1775. In that will he identifies his sons Thomas, Robert, Peter, and William, among others such as his wife and daughters. However, he only mentions one grandchild. And that happens to have been John Patterson, son of Thomas.
"Item I give and bequeath unto my son Thomas fifty pounds lawfull mony of South Carolina to be leveed out of my estate and all my cloathes except my fir hat and one gray three year old mare and colt to his son John."
Thus, we DO know that Thomas had a son named John. And, we do know that John and Thomas Patterson both lived in Buncombe Co., NC in 1800 and were enumerated "next to each other" in the semi-alphabetical list.
Let me explain. The census taker did not alphabetize his list. However, he did have a section of each letter of the alphabet. So one cannot tell if John Patterson lived next to George Black, based on the census. However, within the "P" section, it was not alphabetized, so one has to assume that two names next to each other, were either living next to each other, or were fairly close since no other "P" starting name was listed between them. In this case, Thomas Patterson and John Patterson were next to each other in Buncombe in 1800. Subsequent mapping of the deeds do show that the land John bought in 1805 was bordering the land that the sheriff sold in 1804 that had belonged to Thomas. Draw whatever conclusions you wish, but that's enough for me. John was most likely living on the same land that Thomas had, or was renting land next to him, which had previously been owned by their Black cousins and/or brother-in-law (George Black, and later Reuben Black).
Conclusions
2. Furthermore, there is no doubt in my mind that Robert Patterson of Buncombe was a brother of said John Patterson, and therefore another son of Thomas.
Wes Patterson
